Wiring to Choose Battery Power or Track Power - Help Please

[BakerJohn]

Hello all and Happy December!

Yesterday I purchased a Piko 25 Ton loco on eBay. Today I began prep work for it. I already know what I want it to look like, so this morning I was drawing up a wiring diagram. I've done this twice now (though it has been a few years), so most of the diagram is hypothetically good to go. What I'm not sure about is the switch. It seems to me, that in order to choose between three positions (Track Power - Charging - Battery Power) I'd need a DP3T Switch.

For clarity, this means that I'd need a ON-ON-ON switch where the charging position will behave as OFF so long as the charger is not connected. This is what I've done with my previous two locos. Additionally, My receiver is as labeled, which I get from PhilP . In this configuration, lights will be connected to the Rx and ONLY work when in battery mode. I want to keep the option for track power mainly for roundy-round (i.e. under the tree) or when my young cousins visit. This will be my beater engine, so if they drop it, it'll be OK.
Finally, I am a little concerned that my motor wires from the Rx will be problematic if running track power. Won't they allow power to reach the board when not wanted??

Any thoughts, suggestions, etc are always appreciated!

 

[dunnyrail]

Hello all and Happy December!

Yesterday I purchased a Piko 25 Ton loco on eBay. Today I began prep work for it. I already know what I want it to look like, so this morning I was drawing up a wiring diagram. I've done this twice now (though it has been a few years), so most of the diagram is hypothetically good to go. What I'm not sure about is the switch. It seems to me, that in order to choose between three positions (Track Power - Charging - Battery Power) I'd need a DP3T Switch.

For clarity, this means that I'd need a ON-ON-ON switch where the charging position will behave as OFF so long as the charger is not connected. This is what I've done with my previous two locos. Additionally, My receiver is as labeled, which I get from PhilP . In this configuration, lights will be connected to the Rx and ONLY work when in battery mode. I want to keep the option for track power mainly for roundy-round (i.e. under the tree) or when my young cousins visit. This will be my beater engine, so if they drop it, it'll be OK.
Finally, I am a little concerned that my motor wires from the Rx will be problematic if running track power. Won't they allow power to reach the board when not wanted??

Any thoughts, suggestions, etc are always appreciated!

View attachment 335751

With my loco’s that can be battery or track power I use a DPDT CO switch powered from Track or Battery to circuit within the loco. Battery on/off is resolved with a Fosworks Loom where the battery is charged when charging socket but via boards when not, then an SPST On/Off on the Loom turns the battery on providing the DPDT is set to Battery. Best to label this switch with Dyno Tape.

You may struggle to get this in with a 25 tonner, have a look at my battery only conversion to mine.

Thread 'Modifying a Piko 25 Tonner to Battery Power.'

11 Nov 2018

Now I imagine that some on here will be wondering why he is doing that when there exists a Battery Powered one already? Well the answer is that I have no need for a Track Cleaning Loco, I want one that is controllable (the Track Cleaner to the best of my knowledge can only be made to go Backwards or Forwards), I want Sound and I was not prepared to pay the premium cost of the Track Cleaner. Finally the Track Cleaner has Traction Tyres a particular hate of mine!

So I searched the net and found that Tops Slots in Blackpool were offering a Blue one for £159.99 plus £2.99 Postage. Great deal...

• dunnyrail
• Replies: 46
• Forum: Battery Power

• 

 

[dunnyrail]

Oh sorry John just seen your comment on my 25tonner thread!

 

[BakerJohn]

Oh sorry John just seen your comment on my 25tonner thread!

Ha! No problem at all! I appreciate any help. I am nervous about fitting it all, but once I have the thing I'll be able to figure out what I can manage. I really like fuel tank and utility box you added to get all your bits to fit. I expect I may have to do a bit of the same, based on your thread.

 

[PhilP]

Hello all and Happy December!

Yesterday I purchased a Piko 25 Ton loco on eBay. Today I began prep work for it. I already know what I want it to look like, so this morning I was drawing up a wiring diagram. I've done this twice now (though it has been a few years), so most of the diagram is hypothetically good to go. What I'm not sure about is the switch. It seems to me, that in order to choose between three positions (Track Power - Charging - Battery Power) I'd need a DP3T Switch.

For clarity, this means that I'd need a ON-ON-ON switch where the charging position will behave as OFF so long as the charger is not connected. This is what I've done with my previous two locos. Additionally, My receiver is as labeled, which I get from PhilP . In this configuration, lights will be connected to the Rx and ONLY work when in battery mode. I want to keep the option for track power mainly for roundy-round (i.e. under the tree) or when my young cousins visit. This will be my beater engine, so if they drop it, it'll be OK.
Finally, I am a little concerned that my motor wires from the Rx will be problematic if running track power. Won't they allow power to reach the board when not wanted??

Any thoughts, suggestions, etc are always appreciated!

View attachment 335751

Hi John,

You need two switches:

1. In the positive lead from the battery.. It can be an On/On two-position SPDT switch, or it can be a On/Off/On centre-off switch.
Battery feeds into the wiper (centre connection), one side to the receiver, the other to the charging socket.

This switch turns the receiver supply Off/On.

2. Between the motor output of the receiver and the motor.
This needs to be a DPDT centre-off switch. - Centre-off, so there is no chance of having track power (of either polarity) reaching the receiver outputs.
Motor wired to the centre contacts.
Track-power to one side, motor-outputs from the receiver to the other side.

PhilP

 

[BakerJohn]

Hi John,

You need two switches:

1. In the positive lead from the battery.. It can be an On/On two-position SPDT switch, or it can be a On/Off/On centre-off switch.
Battery feeds into the wiper (centre connection), one side to the receiver, the other to the charging socket.

This switch turns the receiver supply Off/On.

2. Between the motor output of the receiver and the motor.
This needs to be a DPDT centre-off switch. - Centre-off, so there is no chance of having track power (of either polarity) reaching the receiver outputs.
Motor wired to the centre contacts.
Track-power to one side, motor-outputs from the receiver to the other side.

PhilP

Ok, so my concern was valid. Thanks for this, Phil. You've always got the answers I need!
Did I understand you right?

Jon, You're right, I don't know how I'm going to find space for two switches on this thing.

 

[PhilP]

John,
Does your 25 tonner have the Piko 3-position switch already?

I have had a couple come my way, which were track-powered, but had a 3-podition slide-switch fitted.

If yours has this switch, you are halfway there..


For switching the receiver on, there are now e-switch options, so you don't need to find a position for a switch, just a place behind a panel for a reed-switch, and use a magnet.
You can wire the charging socket, to switch the battery away from the receiver.

PhilP

 

[Software Tools]

Having anything related to the motor connected directly to a track pickup is a very bad idea for the sort of thing you are attempting to do.

 

[dunnyrail]

Ok, so my concern was valid. Thanks for this, Phil. You've always got the answers I need!
Did I understand you right?

Jon, You're right, I don't know how I'm going to find space for two switches on this thing.
View attachment 335756

My side switch/charge socked hider is the key to getting the additional space. In my conversion a small fake tank hides those, but no reason why you could not do a slightly larger say removable tool box to hide things. I wonder if the original circuit board could be left in with the track/battery dpdt feeding that with power thus aleiviating softwares’s concerns. My box on the back could be key for the Rx65. What I have done is make full sized duplicates of key components to test fit thus working things out prior to fit, pull apart, fit new configuration, pull apart etc thus saving damaging delicate components.

 

[justme igor]

I would say or track pick up or battery power.

For battery power you need a small charging board dedicated to li ion.
Also a protection board! Let the v of the li ion not get under the 2.8v and do not charge above 4.2v
You can not feed anything directly from a li ion battery.
With a charging board you also skip a switch.

For the following i am not sure:
I think the receivers will power down if you turn of the transmitter.

Best Igor