My God Stockers! You really, really are asking for trouble!
Burying Wire to Throttle
- Thread starter FurkaSOCal
- Start date
Greg Elmassian
Guest
Considering the OP lives in the same town as I do, his concern for rodents chewing up wires is valid. So leaving them exposed, or using non direct burial wire is folly. Maybe you don't have critters over there, we do.
No in my case not buried but as you can see perhaps better in this picture I run it alongside the track making it look as close as possible to real concrete troughing as used by the real thing. Two sizes here the smaller with wires and air line the other one almost hiding an air motor for the points.
However I see no reason why you could not bury it a little under the ground by your line.
stockers
Trains, aircraft, models, walking, beer, travel
That's all I have been doing for the last 15 odd years. Works for me - and there is the odd rodent about.My God Stockers! You really, really are asking for trouble!
Greg Elmassian
Guest
Come to San Diego, or I could send you some of our gophers!
You've got away with saying "only a train set" for 15 years? A serial chanced indeed!
I suggested the direct burial wire as an option. But I pretty much agree with Alan (Stockers). I'm using mains wire (as the Brits call it). But new, not used. 500ft of single conductor 12 AWG stranded was around $40 at Home Depot. I use black, white, green and red for power feeds. This is buried directly under the blocks or in the ballast supporting my rails. The following pics show how I made up my buss wire and feeders.
Pic 1 shows the label for the wire I used. I use the wire in pairs. 2 is how I rigged the wire reels for easy feeding. This was inspired by the electricians at work and their wire cart. The setup makes it easy to pull off long lengths of wire without it twisting into a mess.
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2
3 
I pull the wire in pairs to have equal lengths of 30 to 40 meters. 3. Next, one end of the paired wires is chucked in a drill using a screw-eye and a cable-tie. The other end is similarly attached to something solid and unmovable. Stretch out the wire and run the drill. This will make a "twisted pair".
4. Prep the twisted pair for attaching track feed leaders. I stripped about 1 cm of insulation from the buss wires at 2 meter intervals. The feeders are 50cm lengths of LGB 51233 cable. All the feeders were prepped ahead of time with crimp on eyes on one end and about 2 cm of insulation stripped from the other end. The bare ends of the feeder are wrapped around the stripped area of the buss wires as shown in 4 & 5. A paste flux was worked into the wire joint and the joints soldered one at a time. 6. A 200w soldering iron is clamped in my Workmate making only two hands necessary. The iron is loaded with solder and the fluxed joint is brought to the iron. The solder gets sucked up into the joint.
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5
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7. After all the joints were soldered each was given two coats of "Liquid Electrical Tape". The first coat at the beginning joint was cured enough for the second coat by the time I got to last joint on the cable. A cable tie as shown in pic 5 acts as a strain-relief at each feeder once the liquid tape had cured for a few hours. 8. shows a finished feeder. It takes me about 4 hours to finish a 40 meter buss/feeder wire.
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The crimped on eyes connect to the rails at the screws that secure Split-Jaw track clamps. The length of the feeders assures each will reach a set of track clamps even when using flex-track.
Phil S.
Pic 1 shows the label for the wire I used. I use the wire in pairs. 2 is how I rigged the wire reels for easy feeding. This was inspired by the electricians at work and their wire cart. The setup makes it easy to pull off long lengths of wire without it twisting into a mess.
1
2
3 
I pull the wire in pairs to have equal lengths of 30 to 40 meters. 3. Next, one end of the paired wires is chucked in a drill using a screw-eye and a cable-tie. The other end is similarly attached to something solid and unmovable. Stretch out the wire and run the drill. This will make a "twisted pair".
4. Prep the twisted pair for attaching track feed leaders. I stripped about 1 cm of insulation from the buss wires at 2 meter intervals. The feeders are 50cm lengths of LGB 51233 cable. All the feeders were prepped ahead of time with crimp on eyes on one end and about 2 cm of insulation stripped from the other end. The bare ends of the feeder are wrapped around the stripped area of the buss wires as shown in 4 & 5. A paste flux was worked into the wire joint and the joints soldered one at a time. 6. A 200w soldering iron is clamped in my Workmate making only two hands necessary. The iron is loaded with solder and the fluxed joint is brought to the iron. The solder gets sucked up into the joint.
4
5
6
7. After all the joints were soldered each was given two coats of "Liquid Electrical Tape". The first coat at the beginning joint was cured enough for the second coat by the time I got to last joint on the cable. A cable tie as shown in pic 5 acts as a strain-relief at each feeder once the liquid tape had cured for a few hours. 8. shows a finished feeder. It takes me about 4 hours to finish a 40 meter buss/feeder wire.
7
8
The crimped on eyes connect to the rails at the screws that secure Split-Jaw track clamps. The length of the feeders assures each will reach a set of track clamps even when using flex-track.
Phil S.
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stockers
Trains, aircraft, models, walking, beer, travel
Our mains cable in the UK is often supplied as a pair and an earth in an additional over sleeve - often referred to as 'twin and earth'. I am aware that many countries tend to use conduit and loose single strand conductors.
Whilst I expect the extra sleeve costs more, it does give a reasonable amount of protection.
Whilst I expect the extra sleeve costs more, it does give a reasonable amount of protection.
Greg Elmassian
Guest
I used the THHN wire in conduit. The insulation is too thin to resist rodents and even nicks from rocks here in San Diego (where the OP is from by the way).
Also stranded wire, while more convenient, is much more susceptible to corrosion since there is more surface area, and water will wick up inside the spaces between wires.
Coating the joints with rubber is a nice attempt but would not last long in San Diego (and I have a hard time believing anywhere else, but I KNOW about San Diego).
By using conduit and the cheaper wire with thin insulation, I could use smaller conduit (due to the smaller overall wire diameter) and not worry about moisture penetration/jacket damage.
This is a part of your layout that saving money and getting a failure can cause expensive issues later should you have to replace your wire that is direct buried. This is also a common situation where people have given up on track power by not making it bulletproof in the beginning.
Greg
Also stranded wire, while more convenient, is much more susceptible to corrosion since there is more surface area, and water will wick up inside the spaces between wires.
Coating the joints with rubber is a nice attempt but would not last long in San Diego (and I have a hard time believing anywhere else, but I KNOW about San Diego).
By using conduit and the cheaper wire with thin insulation, I could use smaller conduit (due to the smaller overall wire diameter) and not worry about moisture penetration/jacket damage.
This is a part of your layout that saving money and getting a failure can cause expensive issues later should you have to replace your wire that is direct buried. This is also a common situation where people have given up on track power by not making it bulletproof in the beginning.
Greg
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If you really want to push the boat out, the stuff that's for fire alarms these days (not pyro) would probably be excellent, butility expensive
FurkaSOCal
Registered
Great advice as usual! My main track feeders are luckily very close to the house and can be easily monitored for damage. What I am actually trying to do now though is install a station master controller at a remote station on the layout which needs it's own feeders and then some wiring for sensors to stop the train at the station. I plan on using a combination of the ideas to really make the main feeders bullet proof because it's going to be a pain if the power suddenly cuts and I can't find the problem.
For the wires to the track sensors that detect the train I may use some direct burial wire.
PS. Luckily I've never seen a gofpher in my yard but we do have rabbits and rats!
For the wires to the track sensors that detect the train I may use some direct burial wire.
PS. Luckily I've never seen a gofpher in my yard but we do have rabbits and rats!
Thinking about your remote Station I wonder if a fancy set up with 4 wires that is used for two way lighting would work. Whatever switch you throw brings the lights on or that controller in line. Could be used via low power supply to each controller if you have that? Will post a scematic wiring diagram to go with this post shortly.
EDIT sorry I think I made a bloomer in this suggestion. Not sure having spent some time with wiring diagrams that this idea will work.
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Greg Elmassian
Guest
We have rabbits and rats also, live on the canyon by the golf course in Aviara, if you know where that is. never regretted the extra effort almost 20 years ago, conduit still perfect, and easy to change and upgrade.
Greg
Greg
tgood
Registered
Just came across this post and here is something to consider. As a retired FF and electrician I suggest using ENT flex-plastic pipe with solid plastic fittings to glue together. I use this system around swimming pools the pipe is flexible. Looks like small corrugated drain pipe and is blue in color. Can be made weather/water proof. Comes in 1/2 inch and 3/4 inch.
tgood
tgood
Greg Elmassian
Guest
My experience with corrugated "conduit" is that it is significantly more difficult to pull wire.
JimmyB
Now retired - trains and fishing
Greg, I find pulling wire quite easy, however the initial threading (pushing) can be quite tiresome.
wandgrudd
Registered
same mines been down since 2006, (2.5mm twin and earth) never had a problem.