tramcar trev
all manner of mechanical apparatus...
the purpose of the grooves in decking when fixed correctly is to allow the joint to dry out between the decking and the joists...
Madman
Registered
Jon D brings up a very good point. It all depends on how long one intends on having a garden railway in one spot. For the short term, go ahead and do your thing with the wood, whatever it may be. I have been in my home for almost forty years. My garden railway has been out there for 22 years. Whatever wood I placed there in the beginning has long since been replaced with some form of masonry.
pthomson12
Registered
Another factor you may wish to consider is build time. Personally, I wanted a railway quicky with minimal civil engineering, hence decking boards were ideal, cut, painted and fixed to the ground with tent pegs. Instant railway in a week and it hasnt moved since.
It all depends on what you're looking to do.
Pete
It all depends on what you're looking to do.
Pete
stockers
Trains, aircraft, models, walking, beer, travel
With reference to a few comments above - decking boards should be laid with the machined multiple grooves upwards.
The two saw cuts in the bottom are to allow the timber to 'move' with changes in moisture. Without these the boards would curl up. When screwing down, the screws go through the middle of the outer sections holding the full board level.
There are some boards with a machined face on both sides.
These are often the cheaper, smaller boards and I suppose you pick the surface you like most.
If you want your boards to last as long as possible (however they may be laid) use an end seal preservative on all cuts.
The two saw cuts in the bottom are to allow the timber to 'move' with changes in moisture. Without these the boards would curl up. When screwing down, the screws go through the middle of the outer sections holding the full board level.
There are some boards with a machined face on both sides.
These are often the cheaper, smaller boards and I suppose you pick the surface you like most.
If you want your boards to last as long as possible (however they may be laid) use an end seal preservative on all cuts.
trammayo
Interested in vintage commercial vehicle, trams, t
I use Ensele (had a gallon container for years) and found a drop of washing-up liquid helps it penetrate the end grain.
A question for Alan - is tanalised timber still available for the DIY market (or trade)?
When I buy fence posts they seem to be treated with something else other than tanalith.
A question for Alan - is tanalised timber still available for the DIY market (or trade)?
When I buy fence posts they seem to be treated with something else other than tanalith.
stockers
Trains, aircraft, models, walking, beer, travel
I too use Ensele, but other brands are available.
The old Tanalith contained componds of copper, arsnic and chromium - all pretty nasty. (Copper is why Tanalith is green).
This was banned by the EU a few years ago, along with good old creosote.
Now you get Tanalith E (E for environment, maybe?), It contains fungicides and insecticides and a green dye!
In my opinion its not as good, but better than the water based spray on treatements Mick referes to above. Wickes sell Tanalith E sawn timber.
Best to go to a wood yard - look in Yellow pages.
The old Tanalith contained componds of copper, arsnic and chromium - all pretty nasty. (Copper is why Tanalith is green).
This was banned by the EU a few years ago, along with good old creosote.
Now you get Tanalith E (E for environment, maybe?), It contains fungicides and insecticides and a green dye!
In my opinion its not as good, but better than the water based spray on treatements Mick referes to above. Wickes sell Tanalith E sawn timber.
Best to go to a wood yard - look in Yellow pages.
KeithT
Hillwalking, chickens and - err - garden railways.
Much depends on the quality of the timber and the treatment.
I have track laid on Tanalised pine decking which has survived 5yrs on posts with MOT packed under it without warping.
I have decking in 'hardwood' that is twisting in all directions despite an air space beneath it.
Much of the cheapo stuff has merely been sprayed rather than pressure treated.
If you can find a cut section and check how deep the treatment has penetrated.
I have track laid on Tanalised pine decking which has survived 5yrs on posts with MOT packed under it without warping.
I have decking in 'hardwood' that is twisting in all directions despite an air space beneath it.
Much of the cheapo stuff has merely been sprayed rather than pressure treated.
If you can find a cut section and check how deep the treatment has penetrated.
tramcar trev
all manner of mechanical apparatus...
If grooved one side then grooves down and yes to help prevent the ingress of rot a small slope is going to help...Gizzy said:
As to preservatives I have found thru practical experiment that sump oil is exceptional but of course it will support combustion if the timber ever caught fire, its a poor man's creosote. Not banned either to my knowledge....
spoz
What do I do? What I'm told by SWMBO
stockers said:
Well, in Australia the machined grooves go down; there are no cuts in the other side and, as Trev says, the grooves are there to allow the joint to dry out. Mind you, the relative humidity here can be as low as 17%, not something I would expect is a problem in the UK....
I'm not an expert in the UK (obviously) whereas Stockers is so it seems there are different decking board designs for different geographic locations, something I wasn't aware of, and it pays to get the advice of the locals. However, I wouldn't (and haven't) used decking boards in general to support the railway; providing you work with it properly, treated soft wood (usually pinus radiata here) is a better, and cheaper, solution.
In Adelaide I've got work I did with CA treated posts that is nearly forty years old and not showing any sign of significant deterioration; the more modern treatments haven't been around long enough here to make a real judgement about their longevity. I'm currently using H4 in the ground and H3 above it, coating the ends, and given that the maximum age is about ten years it looks pretty good but the jury is still out.
I've also seen work done (usually by bodgers) with untreated posts that has lasted quite well from a rot perspective; as I said in a previous post the usual problem here with untreated wood is termite attack. Not that I would recommend it! And certainly, that wouldn't be the case in, say, Queensland or Tasmania where rot is more of a problem.
As for warping, any timber, and in particular any force dried timber has the potential to warp. Providing bracing so that the potential warp is opposed will help but even that won't guarantee you won't have a problem.
Madman
Registered
It's odd that non of us has mentioned the PVC type boards. Known here by the brand mames Azek and Kleerlumber. The two that I know of. It is available in 18' lengths and all of the nominal lumber sizes including 1" x 3", 4", 6", 8", 10", 12". It also comes in 5/4" thick boards of the same widths. Since it is made of PVC it is virtually indestructable. It cuts easily and screws can be used through it very close to the ends and edges without splitting. It can be painted or left white. There is no waste when it comes to warped or crowned boards. Here are the sites;
http://www.azek.com/
http://www.kleerlumber.com/
http://www.azek.com/
http://www.kleerlumber.com/
Re what Ross mentioned, yes it is available here and what is more the following link shows you a Company that specialise in doing it for Garden Railways amongst all their other Recycled Plastic Products. I have found them to be most helpful and cannot speak of them too highly as a Customer.
They will do any curves that you require (at a price) but their simple Decking is not much more exensive than Wood ( probably around 30% more). Remember though you are not building a deck so the prices do not stack up quite so much. And you can lift it to ake with you when you move,mit will still be in perfect condition!
You do need to support it, I used their Planks which they cut (routed) specially for me to around 2 x 1 (inch) which was skrewed to the full sized planks to make an inverted U for the boards. Support normally required around every 2-3 feet, but if you are on the ground a Brick is adequate flat side down into some tamped earth.
Securing the track, just remember that the colour of this stuff is Black or Brown, both do expand somewhat in the case of my Friends Layout that I help build, it was 0 Gauge Fine Scale. We had to make special provision for expansion as the Boards expand at a greater degree than the Track. So we allow as large an expansion gap as you can in Miday so that when the Boards contract in the evening cool the track does not buckle. The exact opposit of the normal equirement. Once you get your head around this there are no problams to report.
http://www.filcris.co.uk/products/garden-railway-products/garden-railway-products < Link To http://www.filcris.co.uk/...arden-railway-products
I have covered this before but felt that some additional detail may be of use as we now have had over a ear with the 0 Gauge line and extensions are about totake place.
Oh yes and we have built the basebaird in a rockery with the Earth up to basebaord height with of course no problems.
JonD
They will do any curves that you require (at a price) but their simple Decking is not much more exensive than Wood ( probably around 30% more). Remember though you are not building a deck so the prices do not stack up quite so much. And you can lift it to ake with you when you move,mit will still be in perfect condition!
You do need to support it, I used their Planks which they cut (routed) specially for me to around 2 x 1 (inch) which was skrewed to the full sized planks to make an inverted U for the boards. Support normally required around every 2-3 feet, but if you are on the ground a Brick is adequate flat side down into some tamped earth.
Securing the track, just remember that the colour of this stuff is Black or Brown, both do expand somewhat in the case of my Friends Layout that I help build, it was 0 Gauge Fine Scale. We had to make special provision for expansion as the Boards expand at a greater degree than the Track. So we allow as large an expansion gap as you can in Miday so that when the Boards contract in the evening cool the track does not buckle. The exact opposit of the normal equirement. Once you get your head around this there are no problams to report.
http://www.filcris.co.uk/products/garden-railway-products/garden-railway-products < Link To http://www.filcris.co.uk/...arden-railway-products
I have covered this before but felt that some additional detail may be of use as we now have had over a ear with the 0 Gauge line and extensions are about totake place.
Oh yes and we have built the basebaird in a rockery with the Earth up to basebaord height with of course no problems.
JonD