Roundhouse battery loco, pre-purchase questionnaire

I am going to do surgery on the loco bit later. [emoji4]

Now my aim is to understand the RC electronics and put these in a wagon and feed power via rear socket.

I see following RC options

Cliff Barker
Brian Jones
Deltang
Mtronik
G scale graphics
Railboss

Are they all mostly the same thing? Which one is the cheapest?

On my first attempt I am after basic and crude solution. So I intend to try with NiMH AA batteries (6 to 8 batteries). If possible, can leave transmitter for later phase. Just need something to control battery voltage. Happy for now to run the loco in manual mode.
 
053f27ede29a11f05d48c053de5dcd58.jpg


My first setup will look as simple as shown.
 
Mobi - can I make a suggestion to you that I really hope doesn't complicate more than it simplifies....?

If you intend to leave the DCC decoder board in the loco, I would seriously consider bypassing it with your battery wiring..... while feeding straight DC from the batteries in to the decoder via the rear socket may well work with no problems, once you install your R/C and ESC then the output of the ESC will probably be PWM (Pulse-Width-Modulated) rather than straight smooth DC - this CAN under some circumstances damage (or at least confuse) the decoder, and is probably best avoided.

My personal suggestion would be this (and others may have different and/or better ideas...) - pull the black four-way plug off the motor block connectors, wrap some insulating tape round it for safety and tuck it out of the way (or if is plugged into the decoder board at its other end, simply unplug it and keep it somewhere safe). Now also unplug the connector that leads to the rear socket from the decoder board. You will then have basically isolated the decoder from everything (track, motor and battery), but without removing or damaging it in case you want to go back to DCC again later.

Now, with the leads from the rear socket, you basically need to connect these DIRECTLY to the two motor pins (the outer pins, marked "GN" and "GE"). Do not connect ANYTHING to the inner pair of pins ("BR" and "WS").

If you talk to Muns on this forum, who runs Garden Rail Outlet, I'm sure that for a reasonable cost he could sell you the bits to make a two-wire connector lead with a socket at one end that you can plug the decoder-end connector from the rear socket wire into, and at the other end two push-on connectors that will slip easily onto the two motor pins (or if you asked very nicely he might even make the lead up for you!).

To my mind, this would be your best first step, and would mean that you wouldn't do anything to your loco that you couldn't very simply reverse later, for example if you wanted to sell it again.

Just an idea, offered free of charge and worth about as much...! ;)

Jon.
 
Yes I would agree with Jon - take the decoder board totally out of the circuit, but leave it physically in the loco if that's easier than removal. As Jon says, the PWM output from the ESC will likely confuse the decoder if it's unable to work out whether it's being supplied with DC or DCC.

Doing exactly what Jon says means that you will lose the head/tail lights for now, but you can wire those in later if you need to using suitable resistors and diodes to make them directional.
 
Sorry, yes, as Nick mentioned - I forgot to say that you'd lose the lights with the simplified method I outlined, but it will be quite a simple job to wire them back up later (maybe via a simple manual on/off switch) if you want them working.

One question: is the DCC decoder board in your loco a small rectangular one about 25mm wide x 50mm long, or a larger, squarer one? Which type is fitted (known by LGB as the "small loco decoder" and the "standard loco decoder") will determine which connections are simply plugged in, and which are hard-wired to the board. Not that this actually matters for the method I've described above!

Jon.
 
Mobi, for that size loco you will have an all in one esc receiver/esc most likely. At its essence four wires- battery + and - feeding dc in, and 2× to-motor-output driving the loco.

If you are happy in manual mode for now you should find around 7.2v a nice amble around speed. So just add enough cells for this.

Not sure your circuit diagrams are going to win any awards at the institute of electronics ;D I like the one eared dog cum controller :)

Do you know someone who could help in person? It can really help. ..
 
I had drawn the diagrams with my finger on a tablet device :)

The decoder seems pain in back side. :( Didn't have a clue that speed controller sends "pulse modulated DC".

I am expecting to meet someone in this forum in this weekend, hopefully after seeing a real conversion I'd have more confidence.
 
Analogue an digital are 'chalk and cheese'. - Different systems, which only sort-of work side-by-side.

Battery RC adds another layer of 'difference' to the way things are run and talk to each other.. A lot of effort has been put in to making analogue and digital co-exist. There has not been the manufactured volume of battery RC to drive any great level of compatibility.
Different horses, for different courses.

Have fun at the weekend.. Take notes, but make time to have a play if at all possible. ;D
 
Is there any device which can regulate battery voltage (e.g. something like LGB analog control) and something I can simply connect with battery?

Can an ESC be used without any remote control?

When you say Pulse Wave Moduleated DC will be sent to decoder, which component generates it - ESC or RC transmitter or something else?

Looks like I am plunging into electronics rather than trains! ::)
 
Every ESC made uses PWM to control electric motors.
There are attendant voltage losses and heat generated that requires proper heat-sinking to enable linear DC.
It is not rocket science as to the way they should be wired up.
Isolate the track pick ups and wire direct to the motor(s).
Do no leave the DCC decoder anywhere in the circuit.

Depending on the ESC they will usually have directional lighting outputs for constant brightness directional lighting. If the lights are LED's, use a suitable dropping resistor to protect the light switching transistor.
Better quality ESC's also have sound trigger outputs for use where a sound system is fitted. (Not a DCC sound system)
 
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LED-Digital-LM317-Adjustable-Voltage-Regulator-Step-down-module-AC-DC-to-12v-5v-/331561552117

Is this item (or something similar) going to work if I feed 9-12 V battery power as input and feed the output from it to the loco via rear socket?

Is the output going to be linear DC (as if directly from battery) or PWM DC?
 
Mobi said:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LED-Digital-LM317-Adjustable-Voltage-Regulator-Step-down-module-AC-DC-to-12v-5v-/331561552117

Is this item (or something similar) going to work if I feed 9-12 V battery power as input and feed the output from it to the loco via rear socket?

Is the output going to be linear DC (as if directly from battery) or PWM DC?
Click to expand...
That should do the job?

It will be linear DC....
 
I think meeting up with some one who can talk thru will be a great help. It really isn't that complicated, and the consequences of it going wrong are minimal. good luck on the weekend!
 
I can't - this is just a temporary test to run the loco using battery in manual mode (while still able to control speed)

Once I analyze all the RC options and ready to pull apart the loco, will fit proper RC :)
 
in that case it will do what you want. However if you just want to go in circles in a small loop for now....so would using the right amount of cells for a speed you like.

I have an old loco that i put out when i want to run short notice, it just discharges all the cells in series, or halves them into parallel to give to speeds. It has two switches and a charge socket! Bit of a lash up but it lives in the outdoor garage and works well.

When you move to RC don't forget RCS (the owner is Tony W who is a big help on this forum).
 
Tony Walsham said:
Yes. Linear DC output.
How do you propose varying the output voltage of that device with R/C?
Click to expand...
I don't think he does.. He just wants a manual control to try it out I believe..
 
CoggesRailway said:
in that case it will do what you want. However if you just want to go in circles in a small loop for now....so would using the right amount of cells for a speed you like.
Click to expand...

You may have to wait for about a month for that speed controller to arrive, making CoggesRailway's idea seem even better. Also if you turn down the speed on the linear regulator it will waste the unused energy as heat. This could easily give a pessimistic impression of battery life.
 
It was a fascinating experience with fellow forum member dunnyrail yesterday.

I was spellbound at the complexity and vast network of his railway setup! :o

Due to time constraint it was not possible to open my loco to sort out the compoments. But nevertheless that experience has made me more knowledgeable.

I also "touched" some live steam locos for the first time! :)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top